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TED 5000 opened
***Update 10/6/09 – Google has announced they are working with the TED 5000 as a device partner for their Google Power Meter software. Follow the link above to learn about it and to update your firmware. This is pretty big news and will no doubt send sales of the TED 5000 through the roof! I spoke with TED customer service and they said that if you already own a TED 5000, the Google Power Meter software update will be on their site on Friday, 10/9/09. If you don’t already own a TED 5000 but buy a new one, the new unit will ship with the Google Power Meter software. I’m looking forward to seeing if the Google Power Meter software will have many advantages over their Footprints software!
Original Post:
In the future, when the smart grid is finally here, every home will have a smart meter. But the future is a long ways off, so there is no sense in waiting. Energy, Inc., the manufacturers of The Energy Detective and the TED 5000 announced on Tuesday, June 30th that the TED 5000 was ready to order. Well, my TED 5000 came by FedEx today and I had it installed and running in around an hour. While I have only had it a few hours, I am very impressed. While I have already covered the TED 5000 once in my post announcing its release date and some off its features, this will be an overview of some of the first things that have caught my attention.
The TED 5000 installs much the same way that the TED 1000 does. I really dont want to cover installation that much because if done wrong, it can be dangerous. While I’m not an electrician, I do have a decent amount of knowledge around electrical equipment, so I felt comfortable installing it. The biggest thing is to ensure the main breaker is turned off so no electricity is in the panel. But please don’t take this blog post as installation instruction. There are good installation instructions, getting started guide, and instruction manual that comes with the unit, but if you aren’t that comfortable around electrical equipment call an electrician. If the electrician is competent he will be done in under 30 minutes as it is not hard at all for someone who knows what they are doing.
Display Unit
I purchased the TED 5000-C, which is the model that comes with the Display Unit. You can purchase the TED 5000-G which does not come with a display unit and you would just access the data through your computer. I think the display unit is very cool, so I paid the extra $40 bucks and got it. The total amount I paid was $239.95 before taxes and shipping. When I opened the TED 5000 there were three smaller packages containing:
- MTU – this comes with the current transformers (CTs) and wires and installs in your breaker panel. It sends data to the…
- Gateway – This is plugged in an electrical outlet by your computer. It receives signals from the MTU over your home’s wiring. It then sends data over an Ethernet cable to your router or directly to a computer. It can also send data wirelessly (ZigBee) to the ….
- Display unit – This is an option but I highly recommend it. It plugs into the wall for power but gets its data from the Gateway over a wireless connection. It looks like a big silver Ipod video.
Aside from separating the Gateway and the Display unit, the biggest change with the TED 5000 is the Footprints Software. They have done an amazing job with this. Unlike the TED 1000, which sold the software as separate and came on a disc, the TED 5000 includes the software in the price, but the software is retrieved directly from the Gateway, meaning there is no installation necessary. You simply have to type “ted5000″ in the internet address bar to access the software after the Gateway is connecting to your network. (see screen shot of software on my computer at the end of the post)
Initial configuration is all done through a set-up wizard. I did notice one error in the “Quick Start Guide” when setting up the software. The guide instructs you to start from the “Setup Menu”, but they must have made a revision, because there is no “Setup Menu”. You have to go to “Edit –> System Wizard Setting”. From there it is very straightforward.
The guide highly recommends plugging the Ethernet cable that comes out of the Gateway into a router, and not directly into a computer. I would also recommend this because it makes things much simpler. The beauty of having the software reside on the Gateway is that as long as the Gateway is connected to your home router, you will be access the data from any computer on your home network! I had to do this because my laptop is wireless and I use a VPN to get on my work network. When I tried to access the TED 5000 software while on the VPN, I had trouble connecting. When I booted up the desktop, which is not wireless, I was able to access the software right away. This is the beauty of having the software reside on the Gateway and connecting the Gateway to the router!
Energy, Inc. has definitely beefed up the footprints software and it is much more intuitive and helpful. There are many, many features. The biggest of which is that you can EXPORT THE DATA! If you recall, this is why I returned my TED 1000 unit. The Gateway unit has internal memory that stores the data (up to 90 days of hourly data, 24 months of daily data, and 10 years of monthly data). The TED 1000 had no internal memory so it had no way to store and export the data unless you used your computer for that function. Since the Gateway has internal memory it can store data when your computer is off. This is great for seeing how your house uses energy while you sleep or when you are on vacation.
Exporting the data is vey simple and the data is exported in a .CSV format so you can easily view it in Excel.
Finally, another great feature is that the Footprints software has a widget that displays your local weather. All you have to do is tell it your zip code. Now, my only suggestion for Energy, Inc. is that they store the average temperatures and export those values with the energy data. This way, you can see how the local weather is affecting your energy consumption and track those changes over the season.
Overall, the TED 5000 has been greatly improved and is one of the best tools I can think of to get control over your electricity consumption. Much more to come in the following weeks!
***Update – 8/18/09 – The TED 5000 iPhone app has been released and is available in the app store. Check out my review here: TED 5000 iPhone app
***Update – 9/13/09 – See what kind of stuff you can do with the TED 5000 data once you have it installed in my latest blog on outside temperature impacts on energy consumption.
***Update – 10/07/09 – Several comments have noted you can’t purchase the TED 5000 from Energy, Inc.’s website, but that has now changed and they do list them for sale and purchase online at the TED 5000 store.
***Update -11/11/09 – So don’t get me wrong. I still love my TED 5000 and the fact I can see my home’s energy consumption on my iPhone with Google PowerMeter but I’m wondering about the quality of the TED 5000. While my monitoring still works, my display unit conked out last week and I have yet to hear back from info@mapawatt about what I need to do to return it. Another Mapawatt team member had an out of box failure with an MTU unit and had some issues getting support as well. Come on TED! I know your swamped right now, but let’s get these problems solved asap!
Footprints Screenshot
Chris, Any luck?
The problem I see with a separate MTU for the AC is that it limits it to the compressor and won’t include the blower. I know what the blower uses and I guess I could multiply that by the hours logged on the dedicated MTU that the compressor is on to get an accurate number. This wouldn’t work for anyone with variable or multi-speed blowers.
As I understand the profiler, it sees the increase in use and the amount and then looks for that same profile constantly. When it sees that again it logs it. If that’s true, identifying when the AC kicks in should be flawless since that profile is so unique due to its size…
Good news. Just talked with ted support and they advised that they are currently in development of a new update to allow a username/password solution and it will be released as a free update sometime soon.
Loren,
Thanks for the update, I called and talked to the TED folks and basically got this explanation; Profiling works well if the load is constant. When it varies it has trouble. I asked if there were thresholds I could set and they said no. I was thinking, like you, that the AC or heating load is large enough to just log everything at those higher levels. Just using the error rate as a pseudo threshold sounds like it might work.
I have a kill-a-watt but never tried it on DC…I need one for 220 for my AC, (they don’t make on as far as I can tell). Your heat pump must be electric heat no?
I ordered mine and it’s en route. My primary goal will be to isolate my AC use and my blower for heat and air.
If it doesn’t I would have to say the unit missed it’s real promise.
Mark, you might try using a Watts Up! Pro for 220v. I believe that in the last few years they changed the unit to handle 220v, although it may not appear that way on the outside and you may need to make an adapter cord (just give a call to their customer support). The unit is much more expensive than a killawatt, but it includes data logging and software for power analysis.
I received my 5000 today and the install went well. I want to thank everyone here for the extra personal information. Finding this blog entry and comments convinced me to buy the product. The TED people should note how useful this comment thread is. People now tend to rely on message boards for product support.
My only problem is that the display will only work when somewhat near the gateway (in the basement). I can probably experiment with moving the gateway upstairs when I get a chance (my house is network-wired).
Thanks again to all here!
I installed my 5000sc today and ran into a problem. While uploading the gateway firmware update, my computer locked up and now the gateway doesn’t seem to be working. The light on the side is steady amber and I cannot access the Footprints site. Has anyone heard of this? It was working before the upload.
Jeff … mine just locked up as well with the solid light. How do you reset this thing???
Patrick,
Try unplugging the power cord from the back of the display unit’s cradle. Dont just unplug the cord from the wall, but take the power cord out of the display unit cradle, then plug it back in. For some reason just removing the display unit from the cradle doesn’t unlock it, but unplugging the power from the cradle does the trick.
Chris:
I don’t have a display unit … we are talking about resetting the gateway. And, already tried unplugging several times.
Patrick,
There is a small reset button next to the led on the side of the Gateway. Try plugging in the Gateway and press the button with a pencil for about 30 seconds. This may work for you. It did not work on mine so the company is sending me a replacement with the latest firmware preinstalled.
I finally received my replacement Gateway on Saturday. It came preloaded with the latest firmware. Everything is working ok but I get a lot of false readings. When my solar output is high my consumption numbers go up also. For example, when it is cloudy and I am producing about 1kW my consumption is usually under 1. When it is sunny and my production goes over 3kW my consumption rises over 1.5kW even with all of my major appliances off. My other issue is that the display does not reflect net metering but rather adds my production and consumption numbers.
How close are the solar CTs to your energy consumption CTs? What do you think the problem is?
I spoke to the guys at Energy Inc and it seems the software isn’t set up to do the math I am looking for. I did change a setting that shows me my actual net metering numbers but there is no way to show actual load while generating solar power. They said they will be offering some software updates soon that I may find useful. Tomorrow there is going to be an upgrade available on their website. We were also trying to figure out why I can’t get my local weather on the dashboard. Hopefully, the update will help.
Jeff – I got my TED5000 this week and have set it up with my Solar system. I experience exactly the same problem you describe: no way to show actual load while generating. Shouldn’t this just be a sign change (+ to -) in Footprints? Did TED tech support give you any solutions?
As mentioned by Tom, this blog and discussion was also instrumental in my purchase of the 5000-C, which I installed about 5 days ago. Here’s my story:
Initially, the Gateway didn’t work when plugged into ANY outlets near my wireless router (likely due to numerous switching power supplies on that particular circuit), so I went with a direct-to-PC connection between the Gateway and my HA system located very near the breaker box.
At that point, another nasty issue arose which has also been discussed here – interference with X10 signals. Virtually every light in our house is automated by a custom SBC that monitors passive IR sensors in all living areas to control the lighting. The system has been rock solid for over 10 years, but the TED 5000 played havoc with the X10 modules right off the bat.
Changing data update rates, X10 house codes, and breaker positions for the MTU didn’t help, and I was ready to return the TED but decided to try one more idea … isolating and filtering the MTU and Gateway on their own AC circuit. This is only possible because I have access BEHIND the breaker box. I pulled one leg of the AC (120v) outside the box, through an X10 XPPF noise filter to an outlet strip where I plugged in the Gateway and supplied power back to the white and black wires of the MTU, then ran ethernet from Gateway to the nearby HA computer.
Voila – no more X10 interference! The TED 5000-C works fine with only a 120v connection (MTU red wire left floating) as long as you select 120v (BK,WH) for the MTU type in System Setup. This solves both PLC problems (switching power supplies and X10 interference) and since the HA computer is networked, I can still pull up the Footprints software anywhere in the house.
Now if only the daily cost calculations were a bit more accurate. We have 2-season, 3-tier $/Kwh pricing which I’ve dutifully entered in the Utility Settings Wizard, but the numbers are consistently low by about 20%. Maybe another firmware update is in the works…
My MTU just died on my 5000, no lights at all anymore on the MTU, it was about 2 months old, I had not even attempted to update it yet.
I am very annoyed that they do not appear to answer or monitor emails, you appear to have to call about anything that goes wrong.
Guys: If you put a support email address on your website you should probably monitor it…
While it worked it worked decent, it does screw up X10 completely…having it running randomly (usually within an hour or less) turns on *ALL* of my X10 controlled lights, if I turn them off, they will be back on in under an hour…
I had the same issue with X10 (power line carrier) and tried a similar approach as Trev: I ran a separate circuit from the panel to a wiring box, put an X10 noise filter in there, and then ran a circuit from there to an outlet. I hard-wired the MTU into the outlet (black only) and plugged the Gateway into the outlet. Now I get perfect communication between the MTU and the Gateway. The only problem I have is that I am getting very wrong wattage-use measurements. I am sure that the two red dots on the clamps are pointing in the same direction of electricity flow, so I may have a bad part, and plan to contact the TED people. I may also reverse a clamp, in case one of the clamps has its internal parts reversed (someone here suggested that was the case with their clamps).
Honestly, I think the right answer for these guys, however, is to put a WiFi chip in the MTU, another in the Gateway, and a third in the Display. Most people have wifi coverage throughout their house, and doing this would cut out the main problems most people seem to have, which really have nothing to do with measuring power: signal problems getting the MTU and Gateway to talk over powerline carrier, and distance limitations between the Display and the Gateway. WiFi chips cost $5 each these days, I believe, and I think this would eliminate most of the installation issues we are reading about here.
So what does everyone think of the Google announcement?
I think this is wonderful news. I looked at Googlepower and didn’t qualify so I found TED and ordered the 5002G set about a week ago, before knowing of the Google/Ted alliance. It should arrive Friday and I’ll have it installed the same day.
I just installed a standby generator with auto transfer switch, so I plan to monitor both the main and then any use of the generator also.
This was all prompted by my power company going to Smart Metering and coming up with this new rate plan that charges $2.70 a KwHr (NOT a typo) for 5 Kw minimum for the highest 15 minute period in a month. They tossed out tiered rates for this arbitrary Demand Fee and raised our base rate to $40 a month. So every residential customer will now be charged $53.50 base a month. I’m 7 days into my month and I’m at 16.554 Kw peak for the additional charge of $44.70.
This outrageous charge is regressive and provides no incentive to converse power. They are using the smart metering as a tool to gouge their customers. They won’t even tell us when we hit our peak and surely it is not directly correlated to their peak demand.
I hope TED will provide the data for me to demonstrate to the utility and customers how wrong this is.
Wow Mike, that is definitely a raw deal. The smart meters should be about helping customers CONSERVE, not just to make more money for the Utilities. If you dont mind me asking, who is the Utility or what state do you live in?
Possible tip for isolating PLC signals from existing X10 signals. My newer home has one Arc-Fault breaker to supply bedroom outlets only. It seems to completely isolate X10 signals from other circuits. I would expect using such a breaker for the MTU & gateway would be similar to using an X10 noise filter, with cleaner wiring. But, such breakers are admittedly expensive.
Looks like access to the software from Google is still restricted. Does anyone have a copy yet?
The TED people told me it wont be up on their website for download until Friday. But if you ordered a TED recently it will probably ship with the new software. I still dont know if this new software will somehow get past some of the firewall issues?
Actually, I was wondering about the other side of the equation, the Google side. Their software doesn’t seem to be available yet, except to a limited few.
I dont think Google only gives the software for people who have the ability to use it, so people whose utility has a smart meter and has teamed with Google or people who have the TED. I’m guessing Google is doing this so they dont get 1,000,000 people trying to download software they can’t use. For this reason, they will probably only distribute the software through the device vendors.
I just got my TED 5000, upgraded firmware…
The first problem was the MTU communitcation wasn’t getting to my gateway in my office… so I found a plug upstairs and the gateway works and im lucky to have a router close by… So now the gateway is receiving data…
2nd problem: I’m getting data to the web page and the display unit is working…. BUT it only showing 1watts… I flipped the CTs and now im only getting 9 watts. I’ve tried moving and flipping the CTs several times, but 9-10 watts is the highest reading im getting.
Ive reset the power on both the gateway and the MTU… it continues to read 9watts when it up and running..
I previously had centameter connected and was working fine….
so anyone with ideas?
ok, i had the red wire in the same breaker as the black wire which was causing the 1-9watt reading…
my realtime reading is now going from 800-1000 watts which looks correct!
The instructions NEED to be clear about this….
IM TEDn!
now how do you tie into google powermeter?
Get google powermeter firmware here: http://www.theenergydetective.com/upgrade200.html
How do I access my TED data from my mobile phone? I do not have an iPhone and the Google Powermeter is useless to me plus I can’t access the mobile settings for iGoogle from my desktop to add the gadget.
Checkout the Firefox Add-on at: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/7258
Well I finally received my TED5000-SC last Friday and got it hooked up in no time. My PV system is not fully hooked up yet so I am not running the solar side of things yet. However, I did run into a problem getting to the Gateway via the browser due to being a Mac user, but I got that figured out, thanks to this support blog, and I am on my way.
I have seem some strange readings though. Maybe someone can explain:
1) My readings are in a constant state of change. Jumping 5-10W every display reading update (every 2 sec) even though nothing is changing in the house.
2) It seems to read low wattage… like it shows 68W when I know i have at least 200W or more running.
3) The readings sometimes drops to zero watts which is impossible! But if I start a kettle or something, it does jump to 1300W, but when the kettle kicks off, it takes sometimes 10 seconds or more to show that.
I am not sure if this is an indicator that one of the CT’s are miss marked and needs to be flipped? But i know that I am reading quite low most of the time. (138W for full house load even with 6x 23W CFL bulbs and 5 x 50W halogens running + all phantom loads)
Any suggestions?
I have read about the TED having a lot of issues with getting and receiving the signal. It could be something in your house like a microwave or your tv causing the issues
One other question I did have was in regards to setting up my router so I can access my API outside my home network. I have a Firefox add-on called TED the Toolbar but i need to be able to access my gateway (apparently by typing in http://gatewayip/api/LiveData.xml where “gatewayip” is the IP address or the device name). I run a Apple iMac and the Apple Airport Extreme wireless router. Can someone give me instructions on how to open up the port the gateway is using so I can access it from any computer outside my home network. for example, I wish to look at my home energy consumption while I am at work.
Thanks again
After not getting any support from the company, I decided to start my own support group…
For those interested…. Join here
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/TheEnergyDetective/
First off… I find it so ANNOYING that TED site has email that it seems no one monitors….
I have a solar array and I track what is coming in from it. I also display the TED5000 data using the API. What I notice is that during the day I can see the TED5000 usage going backwards but when it hits zero it does not post a negative in front of the number.
I sent an email asking if there was anyway to get this negative symbol added so that you can truly see when total power is negative. I have to do some assuming to display whether its negative or not.
Thanks in advance,
Adam
huge design flaw in TED.. If you have co-generation. No way around this unless they change their code. They don’t take into account the direction of the current flow in the CT’s. The CT’s know which way the current is flowing because I can see the MTD numbers going forward and backward but when they reach zero there is no negative sign so there is no way to tell if the current is still going backward or forward.
Even if you buy the 5000-SG it still will not work. The arithmatic can not be done unless you know if its negative or positive. You HAVE to know if the meter is going forward or reverse. If the Daily power gets to zero you have to know if its still going backwards or if its going forward.
So as of now if you have geration that produces more than you use in a day TED readings will not be acurate.
Adam, If there is no + or – how does TED Graphing on Hours and Daily work? It appears accurate to me. When I look at the graphs it show how much energy was produced MTU2 always negative a number and MTU2 set for net metering shows + and – positive numbers when it’s cloudy and negative numbers indicating what I’m sending back to the grid when its sunny.
Hi guys, thought you might be interested in a new iPhone app I wrote to display TED 5000 data in a meter:
http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=336208628&mt=8
Future versions will include history graphs.
Thanks for the great article! I can’t wait to get my TED-5000 ordered. The Energy Detective site currently shows that they are on back order but I have to have one! I will be placing my order soon. I will hopefully have my system installed and monitoring our energy consumption before the new year.
I have recently ordered TED 5000 and installed. Everything had worked fine for a while and suddenly I noticed the MTU is not blinking and Gateway is not receiving any signal from the MTU. Since I don’t have a spare double circuit breaker at my electricity control panel, I used the range circuit breaker which is double. But time to time when we turn on our heat, I noticed the MTU is not giving any signal in short period of half hour to hour and then it will begin blinking and Gateway is receiving the data of energy usage. I was wondering if anyone has experience this problem and what would be the solution. Here is my electricity control panel: Rage, heat, heat bump, hot water, dryer are all double circuit breaker. The rest of the rooms, washer, kitchen, refrigerator all are single circuit breaker. any advice would be appreciated
TED units are not accurate due to several design flaws. After-sales support is non-existent.
Jeff Farquar, can you elaborate please re: “units are not accurate due to several design flaws”?
Thanks
After reading the comments about the energy detective customer support, I decided to forgo emailing them my question and just post it on here.
Is the TED 5000 compatibale with Mac computers or do I have to run it on a PC?
Can somebody please post/leave a link for a CSV file with a few weeks data for me to look at. Please remove any personal info. Want to check out how the data looks. Thanks,
Do I have to have internet at home to use the 5000G?
I’m pretty sure that you can just plug the output of the MTU into your computer (since you probably dont have a wireless router) like you would a normal ethernet cable and it will open up in a web browser. TED recommends the wireless router so you can access the Footprints software on other computers in your house. Your best bet will be calling their main number and asking for tech support.
Just sent back my Ted5000,,,,erratic readings, display never worked from day one, had to reboot the gateway multiple times and one mtu would just stop working-had to reset the power source to get it function(with erratic info),,the device is a waste of time,,,hopefully they will do a redesign and come out with system that functions as advertised. to bad, cheers, BJZ
I just put up a video on youtube here of me installing it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GndZwKa4VU
It was easy and I did it with the power on. Got 2 new breakers to use and I had to put the Ethernet box by the circit box for it to work to show it on the PC. But it’s been working real good. Had it now for about 2 weeks.
-Raymond Day
Thanks for the video Raymond. If anyone has any concerns about installing it yourself watch the video. Just make sure you cut off all power to your home! I can’t tell if Raymond is using an external source of light (i.e. flashlight) or if it is a light connected to his home circuit. In any case, if you install it yourself just make sure you cut off ALL power coming in to your house. If you are unsure about this at all hire an electrician.
Energy Monitoring Device
I might be buying the TED 5000 C. (The Energy Detective 5000), in a few days. I’ve arranged for an electrician to come and install it. They can be installed pretty easily but I’m not so savvy with circuit boxes and I think I may have had to get a permit to open my service panel. I got it for my home since it supposed to let you know all sorts of things about your energy usage. I especially liked that the 5000 can monitor wind and solar and that I can view my energy usage from the internet or my pda!
Read more: http://www.thedailygreen.com/green-homes/latest/7-energy-savers-460608#ixzz0oR3rNuhX
One more thing….Isn’t the TED 5000 C. compatible with both Macs and Linux? I think these are two os that the TED 1000 wasn’t compatible with.
The TED 5000 is a great device. I thought it would help me change my energy consumption, but it hasn’t really…but it is still cool to observe.
Ted 5000 is a wonderful thing. There is a game called PowerHouse that allows you to hook up your Ted 5000 to it, to earn points and bonuses to use towards planting trees and such. It’s really fun to and teaches ways to save on energy.
http://nexus.kumagames.com/portal/welcome/t5000
$239.95 is a bit steep for me, the Envi, which I believe functions better is only $129. A much, much, much better deal. It is also a featured device of Google PowerMeter so you get the same functionality for a lower price